Drawing units.

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Drawing units.

Postby B. K. Lemons » Sat Jun 30, 2007 5:03 pm

On-board Help gives the following instructions for setting drawing units. Those portions of the instructions directly related to my question are in bold:

Setting drawing units
With IntelliCAD, you typically draw at full-size (1:1 scale), and then set a scale factor when you print your drawing. Before you begin drawing, however, you need to determine the relationship between drawing units and real-world units.

For example, you can decide whether one linear drawing unit represents an inch, a foot, a meter, or a mile.


To set the linear drawing units
Do one of the following:
Choose Settings > Drawing Settings.
On the Settings toolbar, click the Drawing Settings tool ().
Type settings and then press Enter.
Click the Drawing Units tab.
Under Change Settings For, choose Linear Units.
Under Unit Types, select a unit type.

Click OK.


These instructions don't really tell you how "to set the linear drawing units" to a "foot, a meter, or a mile." They tell you how to change the format of the units (decimal, scientific, engineer's, etc.), but not the actual type of units.

Neither of the words "foot," "meter" or "mile" are in the Index of on-board Help. Searches for these words elsewhere in Help only put you in a do-loop back to the above incomplete instructions.

How does one really set the linear drawing units to feet, meters or miles?

I think they are probably set only when inputting data, such as in cogo. I don't think MSCAD really has a way "to set the linear drawing units," and all you can do is set the format of the units.
B. K. Lemons
 
Posts: 96
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Location: Nacogdoches, Texas

Postby Glen Cameron » Sat Jun 30, 2007 5:57 pm

Being that we are a Survey Program built on top of a generic CAD program - the CAD information may not directly apply to what you need or want.

The units are defined when you start all jobs via our dialog, when you choose Feet or Metric, and Bearings or Azimuths. They are confirmed when you reopen said job at a later date.

All other references for units are based upon the CAD engine with no Survey routines built in.

Jult like AutoCAD, YOU decide what 1 unit is for (be it a foot, meter, mile, Light Year, etc.). The CAD Engine does not care so there is not actual setting to choose from - YOU know what it is. The format of how that will be entered is controlled by the settings for the units.

For the above entries to work you need to be set to decimal units - if you choose Architectural units, then you are not working in Light Years or Miles - it must be feet.

Based upon how I read the information you have quoted, it makes sence to me. It was also not written by us (meaning MicroSurvey), it was written by IntelliCAD. So their way of thinking and writing is not what Surveyors are used to. We are not going to re-write all of the text that they supply, we are going to simply pass it on and add information to the help file based upon our survey routines.

Cheers,
Glen W. Cameron, C.E.T.
City of North Bay, Ontario
Glen Cameron
 
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Joined: Fri Nov 08, 2002 12:18 pm
Location: Corbeil, Ontario, Canada

Postby B. K. Lemons » Sat Jun 30, 2007 6:20 pm

Glen, thanks for letting me know that the units are defined when you start a job via the dialog, when you choose Feet or Metric, and Bearings or Azimuths. As a beginner, I had forgotten that, and now I can go back and look at that so that I'll remember next time.

As for the instructions I quoted, all I know is that they are found in "MicroSurvey CAD 2005 Help," so I naturally assumed that they are from MicroSurvey and that MicroSurvey has some control over what its instructions say. I'm glad they make sense to you, although they still make no sense whatsoever to me.

It would be better if the instructions correctly stated that units are defined when you start a job, as you pointed out, rather than incorrectly stating that they are defined in Drawing Settings under the Settings menu. They are clearly not set in Drawing Settings. All you can do in Drawing Settings is change the format of the units. As you have pointed out, they are set in the dialog when you start a job.

Perhaps other new users who have the same question I did will be helped by doing a key word search of this forum and by finding the explanation you gave.

Is there a way to convert the units, say, from feet to metric or visa versa, for example, after the job is already started and the units have already been set? Or are you stuck with the units you've chosen when first starting a project?

Thanks.
Last edited by B. K. Lemons on Sat Jun 30, 2007 6:52 pm, edited 2 times in total.
B. K. Lemons
 
Posts: 96
Joined: Sun Nov 06, 2005 10:13 am
Location: Nacogdoches, Texas

Postby Glen Cameron » Sat Jun 30, 2007 6:28 pm

From the help file in MSCAD 2005 (keyword I searched on was RESCALE)

Re-scale with a Unit Change

An often frustrating experience happens when a customer tells you at the eleventh hour that he wanted the drawing in Feet, not metric or vice versa. We've outlined the basics below to help you to make the change with a minimum of effort.

Rescale from Feet to Metric

Make sure that all layers are on, unlocked and thawed.

Confirm that you have your CAD Drawing Toggles for points, point numbers, descriptions and elevations set as desired. Changes to these settings will be reflected in the rescaled drawing.

In the General Configurations Options dialog, change the Distances setting to metric and the Drawing Scale factor to the desired metric scale.

If you have a different Automap library set up for Metric drawings, go to the Automap library, select New Library, then Open the correct library for your new units and scale.

Scale entire drawing by 0.3048 using the SCALE command from the Modify menu. You will have to select the base point on the screen so set the Object Snap to point only. It is important to use a known base point so that you can rescale back if needed. If in doubt, create and use a point with coordinates 0,0,0. (Note: If your work includes elevations, the base point must have an elevation of 0.000. If your base point has an elevation, the elevations will be rescaled based upon the elevation of the base point) You will be prompted with point protection for the first point being rescaled, toggle it off.

The SCALE command will update the text size of all bearings, distances, descriptions, elevations, point numbers and Automap symbols to correspond with the new drawing scale and units. These items will return to their default positions if they have been manually moved. If any default settings for these items have been changed, the rescaled drawing will reflect the current settings. Note also that CAD dimensioning will update but the text size/height will not.

CAD text and other items not controlled by the database now need to be rescaled. Calculate a factor by multiplying the feet scale by 12 and then dividing the result by the metric scale. For example, if your feet scale was 1"=50' and your new metric scale is 1:500, multiply 50 x 12 =600 then 600/500 = 1.2. You'll have to rescale these items by the calculated factor in pieces because their base points will be relative to the rescaled drawing. It is only their size that needs to be modified.

Don't forget to correct your scale bar and to turn point protection back on!

Rescale from Metric to Feet

Make sure that all layers are on, unlocked and thawed.

Confirm that you have your CAD Drawing Toggles for points, point numbers, descriptions and elevations set as desired. Changes to these settings will be reflected in the rescaled drawing.

In the General Configurations Options dialog, change the Distances setting to Feet. Change the Drawing Scale factor to the desired feet scale.

If you have a different Automap library set up for feet drawings, go to the Automap library, select New Library, then Open the correct library for your new units and scale.

Scale entire drawing by 3.28083989501 using the SCALE command from the Modify menu. You will have to select the base point on the screen so set the Object Snap to point only. It is important to use a known base point so that you can rescale back if needed. If in doubt, create and use a point with coordinates 0,0,0. (Note: If your work includes elevations, the base point must have an elevation of 0.000. If your base point has an elevation, the elevations will be rescaled based upon the elevation of the base point) You will be prompted with point protection for the first point being rescaled, toggle it off.

The SCALE command will update the text size of all bearings, distances, descriptions, elevations, point numbers and Automap symbols to correspond with the new drawing scale. These items will return to their default positions if they have been manually moved. If any default settings for these items have been changed, the rescaled drawing will reflect the current settings. Note also that CAD dimensioning will update but the text size/height will not.

CAD text and other items not controlled by the database now need to be rescaled. Calculate a factor by dividing the metric scale by the feet scale multiplied by 12. For example, if your metric scale was 1:500 and your new feet scale is 1" = 50', 500 / 50 x 12 = 500/600 = 0.83333333. You'll have to rescale these items in pieces because their base points will be relative to the rescaled drawing. It is only their size that needs to be modified.

Don't forget to correct your scale bar and turn point protection back on.!

Following these steps should minimize the effort required for converting drawings between feet and meters. The concepts outlined will work for any unit conversion.
Glen W. Cameron, C.E.T.
City of North Bay, Ontario
Glen Cameron
 
Posts: 1395
Joined: Fri Nov 08, 2002 12:18 pm
Location: Corbeil, Ontario, Canada

Postby B. K. Lemons » Sat Jun 30, 2007 6:33 pm

Glen, thanks for the above.
B. K. Lemons
 
Posts: 96
Joined: Sun Nov 06, 2005 10:13 am
Location: Nacogdoches, Texas


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